The world of Chaim Potok's novel The Chosen may be somewhat alien for readers who have never attended a yeshiva or lived in a Hasidic community. Yet it provides us an opportunity to better understand the rich diversity of our world and our connection to others who may first appear quite different than us. Over the past few days, you've learned a lot about two religious sects who reside in Brooklyn, New York, and you were left with several questions regarding male and female roles. Below are a couple of links that will help you learn even more and hopefully answer some of the questions you posed after watching A Life Apart.
A Profile of Hasidic Women
Photos from New York
Hasidic women in the U.S.
Separation of boys and girls--marriage
Hasidic Jew Must Leave Movie
After visiting the above links, share your thoughts to the following questions: How is Hasidic life different from ours? Do you believe that it is important that Hasidic Jews live close to one another? Would they be welcomed in your community/your subdivision? What would you say are the primary values of the Hasid culture? And to what degree do we all share those values? What are your thoughts/opinions about Hasidic beliefs/values?
Their life is very different from ours. They seperate their men and women from each other to stay "pure" but they have their people get married at young ages, which seems weird to me. If they don't believe in dating and love, why do they rush to have their people get married so quickly? They also think of their women as something less then men. This makes me somewhat angry and that is why I don't think they would be accepted into our community. People have the natural instinct to judge people who are different then them and Hasidics are quite different. People in my community would brand them as weird and ignore them or some (the immature ones)would even tease/harass them. Even though I strongly disagree with their values (women are inferior) I don't think it would be right to make fun of them. Although, I would probably look at them weird even if I didn't want to because everyone makes judgements in their mind no matter how hard they try.
ReplyDeleteHasidim is a hard concept for a lot of people to grasp. I hadn't even heard of it until we started talking about it in class. I do believe that Hasidic Jews should remain in groups, there aren't many of them and if they spread out all over the place then their chances of being accepted and being left alone start to decrease. Safety in numbers!
ReplyDeleteThe second question I'm addressing is: would they be welcomed in our communtities; Yes i believe they would be. Despite their dress and religious practices they are still people and they need places to live. Most people now are more tolerant and understanding than in the older times. They could live here without trouble but they would definitely have nosy neighbors, people in this country have an extremely high level of curiosity. In some of the reading it mentions how girls and boys are kept seperate and girls don't receive the same type of education the men do, I'd definitely want to know how it makes them feel considering the fact that so many other women outside their religion have fantastic education and are often considered equal [*ahem if not bettter..]to men. Acceptance yes, living in peace and solitude like they're known to do..not so much.
After viewing the links, I have expanded my knowledge on a frequently unknown relgion. My first thought on Hasidic people is that they are traditional, strict, religion based people. This is true, but not to the full extent. Hasidic people really aren't that different from you or me, you just have to search harder. Each individual has his or her own values and beliefs outside a religion. They may agree with some things, or disagree with another, but they all seem to live by the same standard values. All religions, from Christian to Athiest, all bottom line share some basic values. Every religion deep down must know somewhere that killing, and predudice is wrong. Hasidic jews are traditional, they are devoted to their Torah, but deep down, they are just people like billions of others in this world. I believe a Hasidic jew wouldn't be accepted into a commmunity with open arms, but they would still be able to live there peacefully once people learned they are just normal people like themselves. People really are oblivious. They may be unaccepted at first because its new, and people don't like things out of their comfort zone, but after people get to know them, and get used to them being there, I believe that they would get accepted into a community. It really is a fear of the unknown.It's new, its different, people haven't done their reasearch, so automatically they become a little distrustful. But it doesn't have to be that way. If you can realize people are people, just like anyone in this world, you can overcome any situation.
ReplyDeleteAfter examining these links, have decided that I want to focus on what I thought were the major questions: How do Hasidic lives differ from ours? Would they be accepted in your community/subdivision?
ReplyDeleteMe being a girl, I am going to compare myself to the women to answer the first question. Hasidic women are what we see as "limited", like a Hasidic women states in the first link posted. The thing is that those women see it as a "privelege" rather than a limitation. They do what they do for God. They want to please Him and they follow what He says. Of course, us American girls would "die" if we had to completely cover ourselves with what we would consider to be ugly clothing, and also if we didn't get to learn the same things as the guys. And you must admit, we would want to be around guys, too. (;
Such differences answers the next question, and that answer is a sad "no". I don't believe that the people in our community would be very accepting to people who are different than we are. I'm not speaking for everyone when I say this, but we as people don't like change. Change is hard to get used to. It's like moving into a new house. How do those people feel about going into a new community where everyone is unlike them? Nerve racking.
After reading these pages, I find that Hasidic life, in many ways, is totally different from ours. So many of their customs and daily routine is completely foreign to us (like a mikveh.....) as our life is foreign to them. One very ironic example I found was that when I was reading the page about marriage, I noticed a dating website for singles. They aren't even allowed to socialize with the boys who live next door, all while many Americans are trying to form relationships over the internet. To us, it may seem as though the women have a sad, limited life. But that's all they know, so why would they even want anything different? Also, I think Hasids are much more devoted to their values. How many of us would give up fame and fortune (like the Hasidic actor) because we think what we are being asked to do is wrong?
ReplyDeleteAnd also, I do think it is important that Hasidic Jews live close to each other. Not because i don't want them in my area, but because I think if they want to truly hold on to their current values, that is the best way to do it. They shut out the secular world, and the best way to do that is be around others who do the same. Peer pressure is everywhere. I agree with Brittany when she says she doesn't think other people would be very accepting, so the best way to avoid that hurt for them I believe is to stay around those they have the most in common with.
I agree with Aleaya about the strength in numbers. As a community, they are united, but when they're individuals, they're singled out and bear the prejudice from others alone without support from close friends/family. That's why they live nearby: to stay strong and keep their beliefs rigid.
ReplyDeleteThe Torah is their top priority. Everything- their beliefs and customs- are derived from this text. They believe in complete modesty to the point of hiding almost every inch of skin and keeping the genders separate. Strict religious traditions are maintained. The links above show pictures of their beliefs-bland clothes, earlocks, skullcaps, and wigs.
Their beliefs are in good will, but for me, it's too much. I don't like to feel restricted. Their ways of life would smother me. I mean, being modest, religious, and incorrigible are great( makes for great character), but I wouldn't enjoy it. (I'm not saying that I hate them. Actually, I think they're courageous and strong)
I've decided to try to answer the question about their values. After a woman goes through her “time of the month”, she goes to a mikvah and cleans every inch of herself because the other members of the sect believe she is impure. On a different note, children are taught, and almost brainwashed, to pray as soon as they wake up in the morning, to honor and remember God as soon as their day begins. And with marriage, they don’t believe in love or falling in love (which a lot of you have already said). They also believe in abstinence until marriage, and they have members of a sect pick their future spouse for them, which I think is absolutely insane... The other question I chose to answer would be my thoughts on their values. I personally think they are very sexist, and I’m going to focus on the women. A woman’s role is caring for the family, looking after the money, and taking care of their children. Basically it follows the belief that “women belong in the kitchen”. They have a huge list of things they can’t do, like they can’t “sing or dance or pray or even shop in the presence of men”. Hasids treat women like they are properties of men and they hold men at a higher standard than the woman. And sorry this comment was long….
ReplyDeleteI'm choosing to answer these two questions; how is life different in the Hasidic world compared to ours? and Would they be welcomed into your neighborhood or subdivision?
ReplyDeleteWell, Hasidics's lives pretty much differ from everything I think is normal, from their haircuts with the earlocks to their ways of treating women, to especially their religious views.
I very much agree with Brittney on the whole "privileged" and limited views; although we look at their way of life, covered in cloaks and viewing themselves as too...impure( this is not the right term, but it is as close as I can come...) well, we view them as "limited". However, they do seem to be rather vigorous in their belief that all that they do is for Him (their God.) Where as we see them as females stuck among themselves, with so many "DO NOT DO"s that it slightly sickens me. Especially to no "fraternizing with the opposite sex" I'm sorry, but I have a couple of guy friends who are incredibly important to me. I don't think I would be able to stick with that rule.
Also, the way the Hasidic culture looks upon religion slightly scares me. Mainly because I cannot comprehend how they believe that everything they do is for Him, and Him alone. I only know one person who is even slightly in the same boat on that thought, and he scares me too. (I mean no offense; it's just something I do not understand, and the unknown is plausible to frighten some, including me.)
As it goes for acceptance among my community...I do believe they would be fairly accepted, were they nice, polite people. I wouldn't know if our subdivision is too culturally different (my family is kind of hermits when it comes to speaking with the neighbors) but I do believe there is some diversity, and though it might take a little while since the amount of diversity isn't huge, I do believe our community would accept them relatively fast. (Also, sorry that this was such a long post...I'll try to condense it next time.)
I completly agree with Aleaya and Thien Nga regarding the question "Do you believe that it is important that Hasidic Jews live close to one another?" Not only does their way of life necessitate them staying close together, but as Aleaya said, they have saftey in numbers. It's sad, but we as people are more likley to harass someone alone then with their family and friends.
ReplyDeleteWhich kinda leads me to the next question I wish to adress."Would they be welcomed in your community/your subdivision?" I may be pessimistic, but I have to say no: not really. At most they would tolerated and gossiped about. Brittney made an exellent point, and I'd like to quote her here, "...we as people don't like change. Change is hard to get used to." Having a group of Hasidic Jews move in next door would deffinitly qualify as change.
I knew nothing of hasidism before we started this unit and i am very shocked at everything I have leanred so far. Im going to address our roles and values compared to their roles and values. From the articles it is aparant that men and women have very serperate lives and duties in their Hasidic commnuities. Men must learn the Talmund and learn to pray to their God and do all this only with other men. Women on the other hand, must learn to cook and sew and be kind and helpful wives. They must take care of their household and that is all. Men and Womens lives go no farther than this. They have simple jobs and stay alone in their own tight communities blocking out the entireity of the rest of the world. But if you look at how we ive its a complete 180. We strive to learn more and achieve many things in our lives. We want to know everything about absolutly everyone and evrything. Both men and women hold jobs and support their chilren. Although even in the modern households it is most common for the mother to take care of the household but nothing to the extent of the hasidic women.
ReplyDeleteBeing truthful I beieve we Americans are very selfish. Most, value money and possesions. They have some respect towards others but nothing outstandingly comforting. Hasidics ive for their families and their God. Everything in life is centeredd around him. I personally do not understand it all because of course I am not Hasidic. We have other religions in America but they have grown to fit the culture and customs of todays world. Thet managed to keep faith and live as servants to their own Gods. The hasidics just choose to stay frozen in time living their lives as it haas been for many years and how they belive is right and acceptable. as long as they believe in their ways we have no reason not to accept them.
i am answering to the questions "what are your thoughts and opinions about hasidic culture" and "do you think hasidics should live in communities close together"....
ReplyDeleteI do respect the hasidic culture. after reading about the man who turned down a movie role to obey his religious culture, i give him props. i wouldn't turn down something like that for my religion, but then again i'm not a hasidic jew. if i would have been born into the culture, and raised in it, i might have done the same thing. (becasue that would have been all i knew.) i dont fully understand the things they do, but if thats how they choose to live their lives, i'm fine with that. i admire their courage and commitment to do something different.
As for the second question, absolutey they should live together. (though i dont agree with isolation) they're going to need all the support and understanding of another practicing hasidic jew. They can be with people who can teach them. "as iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another..."
The questions I've chosen to answer are: Would they be welcomed into your community/subdivision? and What are the primary values and to what degree do we all share those values?
ReplyDeleteFor the first question, it really depends on what you would consider being "welcomed". Would Hasidim be harassed or intentionally made to feel unwelcome? No, probably not. But they would definitely be talked and gossiped about by all their neighbors. Nobody can deny being at least a little bit nosy whenever new people move into your neighborhood, and that nosiness would only increase if it was discovered that the new neighbors were Hasidic. The more open-minded may venture to actually try to talk to a Hasid, but I believe the majority of people would automatically, even if not consciously, shun such a different culture. At least until they found out a little more about them, if they ever did. So although a Hasid might not be considered "unwelcome" in our community, I don't think they would actually be accepted.
Now for the second question, I think Hasidim really have one of the same basic values as most people, and that is to just uphold their beliefs of what's right and wrong and shelter their children, and themselves, from the "wrong". Every parent does this, when they don't let their children watch a rated R movie or punish their kids for cussing or being caught drinking or smoking. It's all the same principle, the only difference is what is considered to be "wrong". The hasidim see the majority of secular things as "wrong" so they omit those things from the books they use to teach their children. Girls and boys being in the presence of each other is "wrong", so they prevent them from intermingling. The core of any society is rules to preserve the "right" and eliminate the "wrong."
I also agree with Aleaya about the strength in numbers. While I don't think they have to live in large numbers like they do, I think it is probably easier for them to be with people who share the same ideals. Just as we tend to associate with people who share our belief's., it is probably more convenient to live around people who can offer you support. Do I think they would be welcome in our community? Well, I know I would definitely welcome people who could offer us a different viewpoint into our area. It would be interesting to learn about how they view the world. I know, unfortunately, that some people react very harshly to change. I don't know how welcome a Hasidic sect would be in a largely Christian community. I like to think that we would welcome anyone from any religion or culture into our lives with open arms, but I know that that is not always the case. I do think that in time, we would learn to live very well and peacefully with a Hasidic group, as long as they were accepting of us as well.
ReplyDeleteThis particular group of people are different. But every group is different. Their life is devoted around God. They have rules and restrictions to keep them from the outside world. They have a dress code all the time. Women in their culture are placed in a role that leaves them helpless and dependent. I dont believe that they awould be accepted into our communities or subdivisions. People are comfortable with what's normal for them, as soon as something this drastically different comes along we begin to become wierded out and extremely uncomfortable. I think that's why they may also stay together other than strength in numbers as aleaya said we are their different that makes them uncomfortable & if you think about it we are probably scarier, weirder, and make them more uncomfortable than they do us. We get the knowledge to try and understand their religion and lives. With their restrictions they probebly know little about us.
ReplyDeleteTheir values are simple: to stay pure, to get married, to have kids, to have their purpose in life to be with their God, and to do you role.
I understand all the values I listed besides the last one. The others are all common in nany cultures, the way the Hasidim do it is just different from most. The last one to do your role...not every women is the same, their roles cannot, should not be the same. There are so any other factors that should play into who you are & who you want to be other than your sex, which is some 1800th century rule. By having ceratain roles they are not just limiting an individuals knowledge they are limiting the entire world's knowledge. What if one of them is the next Shakespear? The next Albert Einstein? The one who can find a cure for cancer? Although it is important to have diversity it is very important to have unity. All the religions must act together otherwise we are just a bunch of indiviuals who live together, there's no strength, trust, or power.
As we're all reading about these Hasidic Jews and their beliefs, we are beginning to form stronger opinions of them. What if they were doing the same thing but about our beliefs? For them it would seem very weird to see the men and women interacting or finding their true love. I bet they view us as selffish and rude because we aren't as dedicated to our religions. But I admire the fact that they are very true to their values. I may find them different but not all wrong necessarily.
ReplyDeleteWomen should have more rights but thats how they were raised, they know nothing different. And as much as I find the fact that the women can't be near their husbands while their on thier period and 7 days after strange, on that same link a woman said it made them appreciate their time together more.
The life of a hasidic jew is very censored and I think Nicole brought up a great point when she that we all shelter all children but what we veiw as wrong varies. I respect that.
I am going to be answering the questions: Do you believe that it is important that Hasidic Jews live close to one another? Would they be welcomed in your community/your subdivision? I believe it is important that the hasids live near eachother. If they all live scattered about throughout a city then they would be immersed in American culture that they try to avoid.It would be easier to have you and your family stick to the Hasidic culture when you are living among other families with the same views. Also, living close together is important for the arranged marriages that were described in the links.
ReplyDeleteTo answer the second question, honestly, I think that if Hasids lived in my neighborhood, people would think they are a bit out of place.I have never seen orthodox jewish people in St. Peters, so I would be surprised if some moved into my neigborhood. My neighborhood is really not diverse at all and it would be hard not to judge them because they would be so different from us. Even though it's rude, it's kind of just human nature to judge people that are so extremely different from us, though I do respect the views of the Hasidic people. As far as if they would be welcomed, yes i think they would be, for the open-minded at least. The people that are open-minded to new cultures would probably welcome them because they might be curious about their beliefs. I know I would be.
One of the women on the first website made a comment that really spoke to me. She said, "I feel fulfilled. You wake up in the morning and you have a sense of purpose and you don't feel like,'I have to search...'". How many people in our society can say that? How many of us hear our alarm clocks buzzin' and think, "Oh, what joy, another day at school! Just imagine how many wonderful worksheets I get to do today! Maybe even a crossword puzzle. What fun! My life has meaning!" I know that I don't. I realized a long time ago that almost none of the things I have to do in a day will actually influence anything in the long run. But Hasidic women... sure, they can't go to as good of schools, or do alot of stuff in public around men-- but they're happy. They work hard, they raise their children, and they get no thanks for any of it--but they don't complain. It must be nice, to believe in something so completely. In modern America, there are very few people who believe, truly believe, in anything.
ReplyDeleteI think I'd enjoy the Hasidic way of life, if I was born into it. I dislike alot of modern fashions, especially for women-- I can't count the number of times I've been walking thruogh the grocery store, seen someone, and thought "Aggh! My eyes, my eyes! Lady, put some clothes on, please! Think of the children!" And I'd like having less rigorous studies--oh, and arranged marriages! To be free from all the dating boy-drama crap that half the people in this school are obscessed with! That would be wonderful! I'm sure my parents would pick someone nice... and it would be cool to be so very close to all the other Hasidic women, although I do have to wonder about the amount of gossiping that goes on...
Anyway, now that that novel is over,it's time to answer the next question. Would hasidic Jews be accepted into my community? Frankly, I think not. The neighbors were all abuzz with their smirks and disapproving glares when the first African American couple moved in on my block. And I remember, once upon a time in fifth grade, there was a muslim family living in my area. One night, somone egged their house and spray painted "Go home, terrorists" on their garage door. Not pretty. In this area, no one is very accepting. However, if a large enough amount of Hasidic people moved in (if a Hasidic community was formed within our own)I think we would learn to, well, if not accept them, then atleast polietly ignore them. It's like everyone's been saying--strength in numbers!
I think that Hasids would be welcomed into our community. The only thing some people might have any type of problem with is staring. I know I would probably stare the first couple times I saw someone with earlocks. People wouldn't have much of a real problem with them though. Hasids keep to themselves anyways. People may not agree with the way they live their lives, but they have no reason to not accept Hasids into their community. As for my opinion on their beliefs: I think the way women are treated is wrong. Women should have the right to do anything a man can do. And men should have to take some responsibilities away from the women when it comes to children. The prayer everyday and the arranged marriages are just a part of their religion, and if they want to follow it that's all on them. Prayer isn't a bad thing for them to do everyday if it what they truly value. And arranged marriages date back to year 0. They are just keeping the traditions alive in their culture. I wouldn't want to be a part of an arranged marriage though.
ReplyDeleteTackling the first question, "How is Hasidic life different from our's", I want to say that many of us obviously can see how their lives differs from ours. Their clothes, their hair styles, in general, their appreance. It's not on a daily basis that someone walking down the street sees someone dressed in all black clothing and their hair in earlocks. I believe that is why we are prejudice against them and why we make assumptions so quickly about them. Because of their appearance, we see something foreign. Therefore, judging them on the spot.
ReplyDeleteNot only do they come off as different, but their lifestyles are especially distinctive. Living in a seperate community and keeping the boys and girls apart is very different from the normal scene we all are accustomed to. Also, the way women are treated in their communities. As Mary Alice Williams pointed out in the "A Profile of Hasidic Women" article, "Women are constricted by a list of 'thou shalt nots.' They may not read sacred texts from the pulpit or even sit with their sons in synagogue. They may not sing or dance or pray or even shop in the presence of men..." If anything, I disagree with this. Throughout history, someone has always battled the rights of certain groups of people. In this case, it's women. I can't understand it, but that's probably why people judge Hasids so much. They don't understand their way of life. If that is what they believe in, no one has the right to come in and tell them otherwise.
Going off that and answering the question "Do you believe that it is important that Hasidic Jews live close to one another?", I think, at least trying to be in their shoes, it would be important. Hasidic Jew's beliefs are very dedicated to the thought of their children carrying on the traditional ways of Hasidism. Completely agreeing with Brett, I admire how devoted they are to what they praise and honor. I think for that belief to be carried on, they should have close ties with their family and their home communities.
After reading through the sites I was very suprised by their pratices and beliefs but then after going to church this morning I realized that some of my customs may seem odd to them. I think most of us were suprised that all of the women couldn't shop or dance with men but they may look at the catholic religion where we all share one cup for communion and be repulsed. Although I still think it is unnecessary for them to pratice everything they do I respect their choice.
ReplyDeleteAfter gathering more information on the lives of Hasidic Jews, I believe that the separation of boys and girls is one of, if not the biggest, difference between their society and ours. One of the links stated that the sexes were isolated from each other at a very early age. This seems so odd to us because boys and girls in our culture are combined from the day we are born. Even Catholic and Christian all girls or all boys private schools intertwine every weekend at their mixers and such. Hasidic Jews do not usually experience the other sex until the ages of 18-21 when they marry. Marriage between Hasids is like a girl getting pregnant at 16 and staying together with her boyfriend--they usually fall in love AFTER they are linked together. Our culture results in too much divorce because we have more freedom to choose who we love. I agree with Megan and Savannah on the "women can't shop with men" statement. It's different from our society because girls bring men along to carry their bags everyday! I believe Hasids can express themselves, just entirely not in the same way we do. All in all, Hasidic society is much more strict with customs and tradition than ours.
ReplyDeleteI also believe it is important for Hasidic Jews to live close to one another. If I were one, I wouldn't want to have nothing in common with my surrounding civilians. They are able to keep in touch with events going on in their private world. My Dad went to Ladue High School back in the dark ages, which was 65% Jewish, and he knew about three Hasidic Jews. This shows that not all live in a secluded area with each other or go to private schools, but most do. Also, living near each other makes arranged marriages easier, like Dana said. And going off the strenth in numbers view, in which I completely agree with, I believe living near each other gives a great amount of comfort to Hasidic Jews, for they live in a world where not everyone is accepting to different ways of life. When wondering why Hasidic Jews are how they are, put yourself in their shoes and ask, "Just what might they think of me?"
Answering the question on whether it is important for hasidim to live close together, I would definately say yes. I mean, take a look at the guy that took the acting job. He's walking down the street and, as he says, makes a shame of himself to his family and community. He's walking amongst gentiles and throws a life time of devotion to god to the wind. As Aleaya said, strength in numbers!
ReplyDeleteNow pertaing to whether their values differ from ours, they have much different values than our society. They're main values are a devotion to god and to each other. Our society is obsessed with vanity and wealth. We are all complacent zombies. Although their values towards women could be argued as being very politically incorrect, at least their culture is actually striving for something in life, where as we could care less about accomplishing something. Their culture, I wouldn't much care for, but their values system is something very awesome!
Hasidic women and men’s prospect on life and what a good quality of life differ completely. Men are kept away from the women so they won’t have any “special” feelings toward each other before their marriage. The women are also almost underappreciated. I feel it’s totally sexist. I understand why the Hasidic culture might feel that way, but as a third party outsider, I find it unfair to the women.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I feel that the Hasidic culture might be welcomed into our community if they were given a chance. Everyone is so fast to jump down each other’s throats you never get to know a person, so you are just judging off of what you have heard. That shouldn’t be the case. If they were given a chance, I feel they could be accepted well into the community.
Over these past few weeks, I believe everyone has realized that the Hasidic culture is very different from what we're normally used to. The majority of the American society has some religious background, but many are not very strict with it. The hasidim, on the other hand, almost seem to be obsessed with God and religion. Am I saying that's wrong? No, but it's different for many of us. I was so shocked to read about the lives of women. Especially to know that women aren't allowed to see their husbands for almost two weeks due to menstruation. Many "everyday" Americasns feel they can't go a day without seeing their significant other, let alone two weeks. Also, I can't imagine not being able to find my own spouse and experience love and heartbreak. Granted those things aren't always so easy, but I believe they help you grow as a person. I just feel that because the Hasidim are so sheltered, that they never get to grow as people. They're always being told who and how to be. I can't imagine living a life like that, but then again, they don't know anything else.
ReplyDeleteBecause of these immense differences, I don't nnecessarily believe they would be welcomed in my subdivision. Like Nicole said, I don't think they'd be harassed, but there would definitely be gossip. The Hasidic culture is something most people are very ignorant of. I would be ignorant of it too if not for this class. Due to this ignorance, residents in most subdivisions would just find Hasids "weird" or "crazy", but I kind of feel like that is how Hasids view every other American. I appreciate their closeness to God and the devotion they have, but how wrong is it for us to think they're "strange" or "different" if they think we're unholy and evil?
How is Hasidic life different from ours?
ReplyDeleteHasidic culture and ours are very different. In the Hasidic society the women and men are separated from such an early age. Where the two sexes in our culture are taught to be thought of as equals, and are raised together our whole life. This has got to present some differences but it doesn't mean it is bad. For example one of the Hasidic women said that because of the certain time of month that a women can't touch her husband it creates a more interesting relationship. She said it was never boring. This is different from us because nowadays girls just give there "goodies" away to anyone.
Would they be welcomed in your community/your subdivision?
I believe they would be welcomed in my community. I think people wouldn't understand them, but I think they would be tolerated and left to do their own thing. On the flip side I don't think they would be welcoming themselves into my community. Some of the blog things said that they like to live together in their related communities.
After learning of the Hasdic lifestyle over the last few weeks, we have all seen how much differently the Hasids live compared to us. From their clothing style to their homelife, their lives are the near opposite of our own. Women in their society have a much different role compared to women in our society. We have the option to be what we choose, to go to college, to get married, to have kids. Hasidic women, however, have near no choice. They get married without actually dating first, they are not allowed to seek higher education, and they're expected to have kids soon after they're married to some guy they really don't know too much about. It would be strange to not know the guy you'll be having kids and spending the rest of your life with. I would be a little creeped out by that... O.o'
ReplyDeleteHonestly, my opinions on the Hasidic lifestyle isn't going to be the most positive... though for those that know my thoughts on the subject of religion in general, that shouldn't be a surprise. I understand that they do have a strong set of morals and values, which is a good thing when we live in the world we do today. However, I believe that you can live for your god(s), whoever he/she/they may be, without having this rituals that tell a woman she's impure after her period and tell men how to wear their hair. I believe that religion should guide your life, not rule it.
In regards to the question, "How is Hasidic life different from ours, I can think of many ways. In today's society, women and men are considered to be pretty equal; although many men will account to saying that women are inferior to them. In the Hasidic communities, the women are immensely inferior to the men. They can't sing, dance, pray, or shop in the presence of any male. It's pretty sad that in a community, the women basically have no say. It just doesn't make any sense. Also, as Savannah's pointed out, their overall appearance is completely different from ours. I wouldn't really know what to say if I saw a man or woman walking by me who was obviously Hasidic. They dress so modestly, making a lot of people in our society look a little bad. What they think is normal is completely different from what we do. We sit here and say that their attire is so strange, but they are probably thinking the exact same thing about us. It's basically what makes the world go round.
ReplyDeleteOne thing that continues to puzzle me about their society is the whole idea of an arranged marriage. I would absolutely hate it if I had no choice in who, where, and when I got married. It just really doesn't make sense to me.
In reference to the second question, "Do you believe that is is important that Hasidic Jews live close to one another?" Well, I think my answer is the same as most others, definitely. No one wants to be the only one of, "their kind" living in an area. For starters, you would feel so isolated. It would feel as if you were the only one that believes in what you do. This would lead to the impact others around you would have on you. You would probably want to just fit in with everyone, so you're not all alone; even if that involves converting to something else. If the Hasids didn't live around one another, then it would overall lead to many problems.
"Do you believe that it is important that Hasidix Jews live close to one another?" Hmmm... Let's not be stupid. Of course it's important they live close to one another! They have to have all these rules and rituals; it would be ridiculous if you tried to play match maker with two Hasidic Jews that live on different sides of the state. Not only that, but they have to be close to their Rebbi and gather for celebrations. It would be lonely as well for allll the guys to be alone because, can't go say hi to the girls. Might get sexual there. And that would be bad. You wouldn't want to be isolated from your own religon or go through with it by yourself. I think their religon is based on family and going through the religous ceremonies as one group.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Brett, I feel a sense of respect for them because they stay so true to their values. It's easier for them because they have so many other followers doing the same thing...like they're all in this together kinda theme, and for the culture to live on and thrive Hadsic Jews do need to live close to each other. I also feel like because of their beliefs and traditions people do judge them, so moving into one of our neighborhoods would be a reality check for them. People would judge them, instead or them judging people. It would be a test of faith without their Hadsic comrades by their side; would conform or hold their ground?
ReplyDeleteI'm a little late on posting, so I hope I don't get an F. Anywho, after reading more about Hasidic Jews and their social lives, I've come to realize that you couldn't pay me enough to live the way they do for a day. However, I do admire them to an extent. People could really learn from them because they make great efforts to become rightous, stick to good morals, and become a cleansed type of people in order to please their God. People like that should be smiled upon instead of look at as "different". By "different", I mean they don't belong. In my neighborhood, Hasidic Jews would certainlly be heavily judged and most likely made fun of. Sad but true. That's why I think it's good that they stay so close. By staying secluded, they can bind their religon and godly ways even closer to themselves and eachother. In one of the passages it mentions that the children's books are censored to protect them from harmful influences, those harmful influences being "us apikorsim, or if you want to be more precise... AMERICANS!!! Well doen't that make me feel like the scum of the earth. At least I'm good scum, LOL. Honestly though, I do feel that they miss out on a great deal of growth. It seems like they try to make a perfect society in an imperfect world. Test and trial, mistake and heartache, are the kind of things that make the world worth while and alow people to evolve. Hasidic Jews don't listen to music, play sports, wear stylish attire, or attened any events for entertainment. The woman cook and take care of their children while the men work and hardly educate themselves past a certain age. Hasidic Jews are definately traditional because I'd feel like I was stepping into the 1500s if I were to take a trip to Brooklyn.
ReplyDeleteI want to also talk about the whole arranged marriage thing because I'm positive that later on in "The Chosen" it will become a big issue. I can infer this because obviously the more Danny grows the more he'll oppose his religon. I think arranged marriges are BAD!!! I would certainly not want a toothless husband, a lazy husband, a snorring husband, and most importantly, a hideous husband. According to the Hasidic Jews "looks are not important". LIE!!! I was surpirsed when reading that some Hasidic couples have known to divoice! WOW WHAT A SHOCK! I would have never thought. Anyway, to wrap things up, READ MY POST because it's awesome. I can't wait to finish this AMAZING book so we can keep pushing forward.
In closing, this Hasidic Jew information is really interesting because I've learned a lot.
Signed Queen B
I'm a little late on posting, so I hope I don't get an F. Anywho, after reading more about Hasidic Jews and their social lives, I've come to realize that you couldn't pay me enough to live the way they do for a day. However, I do admire them to an extent. People could really learn from them because they make great efforts to become rightous, stick to good morals, and become a cleansed type of people in order to please their God. People like that should be smiled upon instead of look at as "different". By "different", I mean they don't belong. In my neighborhood, Hasidic Jews would certainlly be heavily judged and most likely made fun of. Sad but true. That's why I think it's good that they stay so close. By staying secluded, they can bind their religon and godly ways even closer to themselves and eachother. In one of the passages it mentions that the children's books are censored to protect them from harmful influences, those harmful influences being "us apikorsim, or if you want to be more precise... AMERICANS!!! Well doen't that make me feel like the scum of the earth. At least I'm good scum, LOL. Honestly though, I do feel that they miss out on a great deal of growth. It seems like they try to make a perfect society in an imperfect world. Test and trial, mistake and heartache, are the kind of things that make the world worth while and alow people to evolve. Hasidic Jews don't listen to music, play sports, wear stylish attire, or attened any events for entertainment. The woman cook and take care of their children while the men work and hardly educate themselves past a certain age. Hasidic Jews are definately traditional because I'd feel like I was stepping into the 1500s if I were to take a trip to Brooklyn.
ReplyDeleteI want to also talk about the whole arranged marriage thing because I'm positive that later on in "The Chosen" it will become a big issue. I can infer this because obviously the more Danny grows the more he'll oppose his religon. I think arranged marriges are BAD!!! I would certainly not want a toothless husband, a lazy husband, a snorring husband, and most importantly, a hideous husband. According to the Hasidic Jews "looks are not important". LIE!!! I was surpirsed when reading that some Hasidic couples have known to divoice! WOW WHAT A SHOCK! I would have never thought. Anyway, to wrap things up, READ MY POST because it's awesome. I can't wait to finish this AMAZING book so we can keep pushing forward.
In closing, this Hasidic Jew information is really interesting because I've learned a lot.
Signed Queen B
Woah, how did my comment post twice... oops
ReplyDeleteAfter looking at all of the links, I noticed that the normal American life is almost completely different from that of Hasidim. If a Hasidic family moved into my neighborhood I feel like they would be acknowledged but not necessarily accepted. I think that the fact that most people are blind to the Hasidic ways would make people feel uncomfortable around Hasidim. I've noticed that a lot of people in this area are very closed minded, and it takes someone that views the world with their eyes wide open to accept the differences between a "normal" American and a Hasid. The chances of a Hasidim family moving to St. Peters though, is very slim. NOTHING around here agrees with what their lifestyle is all about. There isn't a yeshiva in St. Peters that I could even think of. That right there proves that Hasidim would not be welcomed. We haven't even tried to accommodate their lifestyle, and I don't think that people would be fond of doing so even in the future, which is a sad thought.
ReplyDeleteJust to start this off, some of the Hasidic customs are just too "out there" for me to even start to understand where they are coming from. I understand that it is important to keep the different genders/sexes separate for the sake of their religion, but to that extent I'm not really so sure about. What I'm saying is that I like the fact that they are trying to promote abstinence and purity, but there are ways to do that without so many strict laws. I do like the part from the first link when the woman talks about keeping her marriage exciting. She has a point, who wants to have a dull marriage that stays exactly the same day after day? I sure wouldn't. Going off of the marriage topic though I wan to talk about the having children right away aspect of the religion. THESE POOR WOMEN HAVE NO CHOICE! I for one am not the kind of person that enjoys having whining little babies around me all the time and these women have no choice about it! That would drive me crazy. I have to wrap this up now because I have to go to sleep! The Hasidic lifestyle differs so greatly from the life that I am able to live and I love learning about this and broadening my knowledge of the world!
Well obviously the Hasidic lifestyle differs from ours quite a bit. As most women in our culture are pretty independent and strong-willed, when we see the words "arranged marriage" we automatically think negativity and put it down. I can personally say that I would not enjoy being in an arranged marriage, as I’m sure most of you wouldn't either, but I think we need to take a closer look at the women who have arranged marriages in their culture. I was reading one of the articles and it said that very few Hasidic marriages (which are arranged) end in divorce. Now how many people in our culture have gotten divorces? It seems like no one can stay together anymore and aren't those relationships suppose to be the ones based off of love? It’s funny to think that marriages that aren't based off of true feelings for the significant other seem to be working out better than ones based on "true love".. I know that the idea of being told who you have to marry sounds terrible but it seems to be working out for these men and women just fine.
ReplyDelete